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pscan 3 weeks 4 days ago #197515

HELP I would dearly love to get and learn how to use pscan but feel I would just be throwing away +/- £200, I'm not a techno fob and like learning but I object to learning by possibly damaging my pride and joy. There is a complete lack of tutorials or how to's on this subject, I was encouraged to download pscan (free) and have a look, why? it just sits there taking up space on my disc it is completely dumb without cables.
Can anyone suggest something to read preferably a book (I find referring back on a PC tedious) that explains how the engine diagnostics is meant to work, how the sensors measure, what effect this has on the ECU etc this does not have to be TF specific just a general view of engine management systems.
I have looked on the pscan forum and to be honest they are from another planet and speak a language unintelligible to most of us. Below is a reply from the pscan team to a question, what % of forum members can understand this? no doubt those that do will respond with "it's a piece of p*ss" whilst the the silent majority keep quiet fearful of showing their ignorance. Reading between the lines of the response is "interesting" it basically says we have no idea, another satisfied customer!
Sorry to bang on but if you want people on board some sort of gangplank might help.

That looks like EOBD mode rather than EDC15M mode. I think that what you are saying is that it is possible to get parameters from an EDC15M in EOBD mode that you can't in EDC15M mode?

If that's what you are saying then it's quite interesting.

It might be time to revisit the EDC15M protocol and see if there is are more parameters in there that we haven't reverse engineered yet.

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pscan 3 weeks 3 days ago #197525

I dont understand that either!
The following user(s) said Thank You: deepfat

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pscan 3 weeks 3 days ago #197526

Okay so I have had a Pscan for about 6 years and yes my working background was in the motor industry but you don't have to be Einstein ( not that I am ) to be able to use it . Pscan is and, I'm sure I'm not alone in saying this , an invaluable tool to have if you own an F ,TF , or a Classic single point or twin point Mini or for that matter any MG/Rover car that has an ECU controlled engine . I get lost when people on the forum come out with all the technical jargon but without Pscan it is just about impossible to diagnose a fault unless you take the 'Blind school diagnostic ' route where you throw a boat load of parts at a fault . The more you use Pscan the easier it becomes . Is Pscan worth the out lay ? Yes it is IMO . Could I run either my TF or our Classic mini without it ? Yes ,but it would mean that every time a problem crops up I would end up paying someone else to diagnose the problem . Its horses for courses Deepfat . If you can use a laptop then Pscan is easy to use . Understanding all the technical jargon isn't really required and if you get stuck the wealth of knowledge on this forum should be enough to help you .

John .

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pscan 3 weeks 3 days ago #197527

Hi,

I recentlly brought a Pscan unit to help try to diagnose a problem I have with emissions after an MOT failure.

Firstly, let me say that it is still being updated and developed and has huge potential. In my case it has not helped that much. Cheap sanner tools seem to give info that Pscan does not report at the moment and it needs to be easier to use to appeal to a broader user base I think. I am keeping Pscan as I feel it will be useful in the future.

I have a TF so MEMS3 ECU.
Does not report freeze frame data.
Does not report Fuel trims.
You need to learn how to produce graphs from a spreadsheet with the data file to help seeing some problems. I can't get this to work but that is down to my inexperience with spreadsheet software.
None of the data value are explained and there is no real guide.
There are no expected values so you can check quickly if some thing is wrong.
Not sure if all the values can be trusted. I am replacing the O2 sensor at the moment because I have yet to find anything wrong with Pscan except that the upstream sensor "Switching Frequency" seems very low from what I can gather from trawling the web but I don't know for sure and that is back to using a shotgun method of replacing parts.

You can download the live data and share it on a forum such as this and anybody can load it into a spreadsheet to have a look.
I tried this with my recent post in the Pitstop section but either nobody can see anything in the data or they have better things to do :).

For some idea of what the live data values mean I have found a website that gives a better idea and has helped me a bit.

https://blackbox-solutions.com/help/SM003.html

Pscan is good but it still needs (and seems to be getting) work.
It's fantastic for older pre-odsb2 ecu's and can be used to program keys, get info and reset erros with ABS, airbags and security systems.

It's not a magic bullit to solve problems though, at least not yet.

If you are an expericed mechanic Pscan is probaly more useful, i'm very much DIY.
The following user(s) said Thank You: sworkscooper

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Last edit: Post by TwistedPuppet.

pscan 3 weeks 2 days ago #197529

I can't help you with all of your points. But there is one really important point. You fear damaging you car with pscan. This is very nearly impossible to do. The vast majority of features of pscan simply extract information from ECUs and display it on the screen. This will absolutely not damage your car. The few more advanced features that maybe could cause you a problem come with a lot of on screen warning telling you the consequences of proceeding and asking you to confirm that you know what you are doing.

The fundamental thing that diagnostic tools do is to tell you what the ECU itself thinks is going on, and that's it.

Unfortunately the data that is presented is what MG Rover designed it to present.

I can only design and make a tool that accesses the featured that MG Rover put into the electronics. I can't change what's in the car. So if Rover design a protocol that allows you to access highly technical data, then you will get highly technical data. There is nothing I can do about that.

As for instruction books, it simply isn't going to happen. Most customers would rather get the features expanded (configure the Pektron, code fobs into the Rover 75, configure the 5AS, fuel trims, freeze frame data, CANbus support etc). To have to sit down and write manuals for twenty nine different ECUs, and update them every time I bring out a new feature. I'm sorry but I'm just not prepared to do that.
The following user(s) said Thank You: mowog73, Roverlike, Cobber, sworkscooper, mnripley

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Re:pscan 1 week 5 days ago #197643

I'd like to say that I am in no way a technician, but have found Pscan really easy to use as a DIY car enthusiast. I've had it since the really early days, and it has been constantly updated with new features over the years.

It has helped me diagnose issues on my TF (now temporarily off the road since lockdown) and my ZS that had an annoying recurring and intermittent engine warning light - turned out to be a gradually breaking down O2 sensor. Luckily every time the light poles randomly on, Pscan let me reset it. The replacement will happen soon, but he's passed his MOT twice like that!

It's definitely saved me money not needing a mechanic to diagnose things.

I'll be using it to program a spare (barcoded) fob to my ZS soon saving me more money.

All in all its a great tool for any DIY mechanic who has a compatible ECU.

Sent from my VOG-L29 using Tapatalk
The following user(s) said Thank You: Roverlike, sworkscooper, deepfat

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pscan 1 week 5 days ago #197647

pscan.uk I do understand your response about not having the time to write many manuals for various ECU's whilst still trying to improve the system and totally agree with you it's not your job. However who are you improving it for? I can only report on what I've read on the TF forum where pscan when mentioned is usually an appeal for someone who has it to help them out and is very rarely responded to. I have looked on the "how to" for the TF's how many are there on pscan? with such a low profile I can understand why many members (like me) hesitate to invest in something that may never come out the box.

I hate to use BS marketing terms but it appears to me that pscan is lacking market penetration which considering it's relatively low cost compared to other (probably inferior) systems is confusing. I respectfully suggest that you consider trying to recruit a couple of people (not techy) to sit between you and us whose remit would be to push the use of pscan, whilst maybe organising a "how to set up and get started with pscan" which would help. Maybe a sub forum to the pscan forum for newbies who could migrate to the adult forum when they had the confidence.

May I add that when I first posted this it was on the general pit stop TF forum which is where it rightly sits in my opinion to stimulate discussion about something that has a low profile "pscan yeah I've heard of it but I aint techy" IF I had been asked (I wasn't) I would have explained my reasons and requested it remain in pit stop, that however is a Q for admin not you.

Many thanks to you and your team for what you have done and continue to do for us, it's just a shame all your hard work is stuck in a niche.

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Re:pscan 1 week 5 days ago #197649

Kind of agree with what has just been said. Pscan could be much more widely used considering the range of vehicles it now works on, if it were a bit more 'idiot proof' (no offence intended!).

I wonder if there are some 'standard' results of the readings that were provided by MGR for each ECU/Model?

If there were they could be added to the readings screen as an 'expected result' maybe?

The actual use of the Pscan unit is incredibly easy, but it is a bit of a mission to figure out if the results you get from it are 'correct'.

Compared to a cheap scanner it is amazing, as you don't need to look up some random 'P' code and then hope that MGR used the standard for that code. You actually know what the reading is referring to.

We often talk about creating a standard set of results, so maybe that's possible by using the unit on cars that have been just serviced and are running perfectly?

Sent from my VOG-L29 using Tapatalk
The following user(s) said Thank You: deepfat

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pscan 1 week 5 days ago #197650

Thank you Adam a good idea and just the sort of conversation I was hoping to stimulate on pit stop.

I think you mean a sort of bible to look at what cars running well at the time show on various outputs to compare with your sick cars outputs, of course whoever posts such records would have to state what their car is and any mods if applicable but I'm sure you had thought of that already.

Is anyone from Admin looking/listening how can such a thing be set up? I for one would be willing to put time and effort into it, after all it's only fair I've complained enough! just don't make it too techy it scares some off.

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Re:pscan 1 week 5 days ago #197651

It should be possible to get a set of 'norms' for each model. Although I have not doubt we'll need to keep these under review.

It's a little quieter in here than it used to be but I'm not surprised as the pandemic has screwed a lot of people over, and I bet lots of cars are mothballed like mine temporarily.

I'm intending to get mine back on the road for next year, plus finally get my custom dash completed after God knows how many years! Plus get the compliance bushes fine after my 'IKEA chipping board fix' (which to be fair has lasted the entire ownership of the car so far lol).

I bet he will need some tweaks (with the help of my Pscan) after 2 years laid up! Which reminds me I need go start him up! It's been 3 months since he saw life I think.... Bad me! 😜

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pscan 1 week 4 days ago #197654

I can only report on what I've read on the TF forum where pscan when mentioned is usually an appeal for someone who has it to help them out and is very rarely responded to.

I respectfully suggest that you consider trying to recruit a couple of people (not techy) to sit between you and us whose remit would be to push the use of pscan,.


Why are pscan users asking for help on another forum?
This is the official support forum for pscan. If they ask for help here then they will get it.
It's not like it's difficult to find; when you go to pscan.uk there is a great big button saying "Support" and when you click on it it links to here.
There are so many MG Rover forums and groups that it really is completely impossible to monitor them all.

As for recruiting a couple of people; how much money do you think I earn from selling these units?

It really isn't that hard to use. I offer a money back if you don't like it policy and in five years I only had one come back, and that customer hadn't even opened the parcel.

Thanks for the feedback though.

It's true that marketing and advertising are difficult.

To my existing customers who clearly quite like their pscan units, please tell the world. As I said I can't be on every forum and every group, and a lot of them won't allow advertising, but you can be.
The following user(s) said Thank You: Roverlike, sworkscooper

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pscan 1 week 4 days ago #197656

I think Deepfat ment one of the other sections here (Pitstop), not a different website

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